• From: Boca Raton Florida, US
  • Registered: 2006-01-05
  • Posts: 1,118

Re: Habeus Corpus - rip

Yes , I have no doubt that Islamic Extremest are real and do hate the west (tho not for our way of life..more to do with us supporting Israel)

The thing is.. who is it that organises and funds Al Qaeda? Bin Laden . Who is it that the Extremets look up to and follow? Bin Laden. Who does Bin Laden and his family do business with? the Bushes. Who does Bin Laden work for? The CIA.

But see, I don't see al quaeda as the people we're fighting. I mean exclusively. They are simpley one of many of the entities who wage the war. I believe ALL islamic EXTREMISM is what we're fighting. As I said, the Bin laden thing sounds plausible with the CIA. I can understand that arguement. Not that I agree with it. It makes the assumption that Bin Laden honors his dealings with the US in the sovet/afghan war more than he honors what he considers his religion. No matter what previous dealings he had, a man can change pretty dang quick, especially when influencial people you hold in alot of esteem say things. He fought the 'godless' soviets, and some foreign guys offered weapons. The next day great and mighty whats his name convinces Bin Laden of the west's evil.

He's not the center of the problem, just an arm of it. One that has gotten alot of attention cause it hit us hard.

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Futurama: You Can't Prove it Won't Happen
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  • Registered: 2006-01-15
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Re: Habeus Corpus - rip

"It makes the assumption that Bin Laden honors his dealings with the US in the sovet/afghan war more than he honors what he considers his religion"


If his religion was anti US/west , then he wouldnt work for or do dealings with the US.


The thing is ,is it hard to believe that he still works for the CIA , creating this extremeist threat , so that we can take control of the Middle East / 3/4 of the worlds oil supply , abolish peoples rights , get rich (war means money) , instill dollar states (the ME was moving away from the dollar) etc.

Once the middle east is under western control  via , ineffect (if not literal), puppet governments theyl create a new threat in some other area of the world and do the same there..

Look, weve got an actual threat in North Korea but we dont do crap about it. We see the ME as an easy victory. North Korea (an actual country) continues to threaten us with war and nukes (THEY HAVE WMD AND THEY THREATEN US! WTF?) ...........Iraq never did this.

"Government is the great fiction, through which everybody endeavours to live at the expense of everybody else."
Frédéric Bastiat
  • From: Boca Raton Florida, US
  • Registered: 2006-01-05
  • Posts: 1,118

Re: Habeus Corpus - rip

Well I wont get into the Iraq thing, becuase I'm questionable about the conflict myself right now. Though I will say Its irresponsible for people to exclusively blame bush, when the congress approved the action with little resistance. But still I don't really want to go into iraq, cause I'm trying to figure that one out for myself.
Now North Korea. You make a good point, though I should mention that thats exactly the same arguement used to invade Iraq. We where led to believe they had chem weapons (and they DID, and they used them.Where they went, I haven't a fudgin clue...) and other wmds, had the missle delivery systems (that they really did) to deliver them. Sounds exactly like the iraq claims, ecept the norks did a nuke test confirming them.
Another however. As unclean as it makes me feel, I trust the norks with a nuke MUCH more than I trust Iran. My personal opinion at the moment as the norks want nukes as a bargaining chip to get more aid to save a dieing regime. While Iran wants to completely destroy Israel, and will if they get a nuke. Iran + Nuke = Doomsday, at least in my eyes. Iran is completely controlled by religious extremistis particularly that guy whose name I couldn't remeber (and now refuse to find again).

Now I honestly don't know WHAT the norks are playing at. Its possible that they really do intend invade the south.  They should not be allowed nuclear weapons. But if you ask me the ONLY way to resolve this is diplomaticlly. You could even say the Norks already won. They now HAVE the bomb (even if the first one failed, the second....or third....wont). An invasion would result in a tactical nuke blowing away our troops, in addition to Seoul's destruction. We should have done something about north korea sooner. Its possible we lost this one. I just hope we dont make the mistake with Iran, who I know will use it the second they get it.

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Futurama: You Can't Prove it Won't Happen
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Re: Habeus Corpus - rip

The main problem with Iran-North Korea is this, North Korea sells weapons to terrorists AND rougue nations (a.k.a. Iran and the like). Some belive that seemingly bold acts such as testing Inter-Continental Ballistic Missles was an advertisement, not a "cry for aid", so as far as I am concerned, I belive that that is what the nuclear bomb test was. If the government knows who they were advertising the bomb for, then they most likely wouldn't, and I certainly hope that they wouldn't, present this to the public, as then the North Koreans would know that we know, and then it wouldn't be as easy to intercept its delivery, should there be one to nations such as Iran, Syria, Venezuala, etc. As for Iraq, regardless of the reasons that we are there, we should stay there because, supposing that we leave before the government is ready, the extremists (I use extremists because it's not just Al-Qaeda that has an interest in Iraq) will overwhelm the government, and a sectarian violence that has been never been witnessed before will begin.

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  • From: Boca Raton Florida, US
  • Registered: 2006-01-05
  • Posts: 1,118

Re: Habeus Corpus - rip

Good points there. Thankfully north korean ships are being stopped at sea, china is now also searching nork ships, and though I'm not sure, I believe the chinese have cut off North Korean flights to Iran. Believe, not sure. I don't doubt the norks are a HUGE danger, but its remotely possible nuclear deterence will work with them. I doubt it will with the Iranians. The norks know if they do something stupid, someone, perhaps even china themselves will punce.
See I'm not saying the Norks aren't dangerous, I'm saying their TOO dangerous for us to handle. As far as I'm concerned, unless we can force em down diplomatically, they've won their nukes. If we, or anyone else, invaded conventionally theres no question they use small tactical nukes, on their own land, to kill the troops. Then we're faced with the VERY bad choice of nuking back. Nuking back right on china's border. I doubt they'll smile on that. Just pray the diplomats can pull a win out of their asses. Cause I don't see anyother way to win it, at least not without a few cataclysmic events.

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Futurama: You Can't Prove it Won't Happen
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Re: Habeus Corpus - rip

Unfortunately, Kim Jong ll is a madman, have you heard of the brothel, where women are on constant call for Mr.Kim's a.k.a. "great leader's"(that reminds me to thank my mother for not naming me, being a male, Kim) "service". I think that they are called the rainbow brigade or something along that line. He cares nothing for his people and is a disgrace to humanity. Another unfortunate fact, is that China usually protects North Korea because, should North Korea collapse, it will look bad on China as a fellow communist nation. So, that being said, I don't know that China's "inspections" can be trusted. I'm not quite sure why Russia supports China, North Korea, Iran, etc.

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Re: Habeus Corpus - rip

Having a brothel doesnt mean your a madman lol ..but yea, he's not exactly man of the year.

FOr the whole issues with Iran , you can blame The British and US governments for ousting Mosedeq , a democratically elected president. See Operation Ajax. The CIA etc created a terrorist regime in Iran and made it look like Mosedeq was at fault. This is declassified and official.

We have to stop interfering in other countries politics. Fair enough if we were the peacemaker between countries (tho this is UN's job) but we dont. We take advantage and even destabalise for our own goals and greed. This is why we are hated.

To say this 'war' is enough to constitutionaly suspend Haebeus Corpus is fraudulant. We are not being invaded. By all means ..if we were in being invaded , like The Blitz during WW2 then suspend Habeus Corpus. The thing is ..terrorism cannot , i repeat cannot, be destroyed thro war and killing of 400k - 600k innocent people. It only angers people and makes them seek out Bin Laden to join up with Al Qaeda etc.

The "War on Terror" will be never ending. Think about that... in 5 years the constitution , the very soul of the USA has been ripped to shreds. Cheyney himself says this 'war' could last for 100 years. You keep giving your freedoms away you will be having curfews sooner or later and George Orwells 1984 will be a very visible reality. It sounds crazy to me ....  but so does imbedding microchips (used for whatever reason) into humans hmm . 

The whole issue of microchips being put into us reminds of a very surreal experience of mine when i was 17/18 lol .. including a 'smoke' , a park and a Priest LOL ...

I was out with my mates in the pub.... on the way home me and a mate thought we'd go for a quick 'smoke' wink (yea , you know what kind of smoke wink .. was a bit of a habit for me for about a year)   before goin home . So, we went into this park at about 4-5am and this figure approached us.... we crapped it and threw the smokes etc .
We began talkin to him once we realised he wasnt a policeman. We continued to drink our beers and smoke. I cant remember how we got onto the subject , but we were talkin about religion and mad stuff. Anyway he started sayin how within 15-20 years we (western world) would be exepted to have implantable microchips ... we laughed at him and he went off on one about the Bible and the microchips being "The Mark" (off the beast/satan) and telling us how the basis of microchips were 3 sixes. It was a really strange experience .... i cant really explain it to well ( was pretty drunk etc wink ) ... anyway after about 3 hours of this we went home.

Me and my mate still talk about it to this day...  big_smile   

Oh, and everything he said is pretty much true and is materialising ....tho im not religious at all. hmm



PS. I wouldnt be suprised if we are subjected to another 9/11 sized terror attack before november is out sad .... or early in the new year. Something to help guide US/UK citizens to push for the invasion of Iran.

"Government is the great fiction, through which everybody endeavours to live at the expense of everybody else."
Frédéric Bastiat